Printable Version of Topic
Click here to view this topic in its original format
City by the Lake.org, The Voice of Michigan City, Indiana _ City Talk _ Lungren arrested again, flees.
Posted by: southsider2k7 Mar 18 2007, 11:48 AM
http://www.thenewsdispatch.com/articles/2007/03/17/news/n1.txt
By Jason Miller, The News-Dispatch
First Ward Michigan City Councilman Chuck Lungren has been arrested for drunk driving for the third time, and a warrant has been issued for his arrest after he failed to show up in court.
Prosecutors in Marshall County this week obtained a bench warrant for the arrest of
Lungren after he failed to appear at an initial hearing Tuesday for a drunk driving arrest made in Plymouth, Ind., March 5.
An official with Marshall County Superior Court 2 in Plymouth, which is about 45 miles southeast of Michigan City, said Friday that Lungren is charged with operating a vehicle while intoxicated with prior OWI charges, registering a blood alcohol level greater than .08 percent with prior charges, driving left of center and having no or improperly operating taillights.
According to Plymouth Assistant Police Chief David Bacon, Lungren was arrested at 12:36 a.m. (EST) on March 5 on Memory Court, south of Berkeley Street in Plymouth, after a patrolman saw Lungren's vehicle cross the center line.
Lungren was scheduled to appear in court for his initial hearing Tuesday, but never showed up. A Superior Court 2 official said the felony bench warrant will remain in effect for five years, until March 13, 2012.
The drunk driving arrest is the third for Lungren in a little more than two years. He's currently awaiting a hearing in LaPorte County to revoke his probation because he allegedly showed up to court-mandated community service with alcohol in his system last year.
Lungren couldn't be reached on his cell phone, and a friend of Lungren's, who wished to remain anonymous, said the councilman had left the state for California in the wake of the arrest.
Lungren, who decided not to seek re-election to his seat in the May primary election, said last month that he intended to move to California after his term was up and live with his sister. He also said that he was virtually penniless and “didn't know what to do.”
Lungren missed the last scheduled City Council meeting, telling council President Willie Milsap that there had been a death in his family. The meeting was March 6, the day after Lungren's arrest.
Milsap said Friday he's “really disappointed” for Lungren's constituents and would be upset if Lungren had lied to him about the reason for missing last week's meeting.
“They'll probably have to go without service now, and that's not fair to them,” Milsap said of 1st Ward residents. “They voted him into office and they deserve his service. They shouldn't be denied that service.”
Milsap's 5th Ward borders Lungren's 1st Ward on the city's north side.
Councilman Joe Doyle, D-at large, said late Thursday he hadn't heard about Lungren's most recent arrest, but said the situation surrounding Lungren is “very sad.”
Lungren told The News-Dispatch in a jailhouse interview last year that he came from a family of alcoholics and that he suffered from a “sickness.”
“It's kind of sad,” said Doyle, who had become Lungren's occasional chauffeur after Lungren lost his driver's license, carting the councilman to meetings and around town. “I tried to help him but he just put himself in a bad position. It's really sad.”
Chief Deputy LaPorte County Prosecutor Atley Price said Friday if Lungren has fled the state, any punishment through LaPorte County would likely depend on any restriction that might have been placed on Lungren by county probation officers.
Price didn't know how often Lungren is required to report to his probation officer, but said if Lungren has few restrictions on travel, the only punishment would come if Lungren misses a court appearance. Even then, Price said, LaPorte County would not likely extradite Lungren back to the area.
“Our policy generally is, if it's a misdemeanor, we're not going to spend the taxpayer's money on extradition,” he said. “If it's a felony case, then we take it on a case-by-case basis.
“If this is his third OWI, then I think he's in danger of being placed in (habitual traffic violator) status, which would definitely change things.”
Marshall County officials wouldn't say if they planned to seek Lungren's extradition if he's arrested on another charge outside the state.
Lungren has had his fair share of trouble with the law during the past three years, having been arrested in June 2005 and again in February 2006 on separate drunk driving charges.
He also filed charges against his now ex-wife, Cindy, in 2004, claiming she hit him. The two were going through a divorce and had respective restraining orders against each other.
At that time, Cindy Lungren accused her estranged husband of “scaring her” over the telephone and at the house.
Lungren told The News-Dispatch earlier this year that a great deal of his issues stemmed from the divorce. His ex-wife moved out of state with the couple's son, which devastated him, he said.
If Lungren doesn't return to the City Council, the body would likely be forced to appoint a replacement by Democratic caucus, just as Democratic precinct committee people are doing for the 8th District State Senate seat left vacant by the death of Anita Bowser.
If his seat becomes officially vacant in time, a caucus could come shortly before the May 8, primary, for which Lungren didn't file. Democrats Lynne Kaser and Richard Murphy will face each other in the primary for the 1st Ward seat.
Contact reporter Jason Miller at jmiller@thenewsdispatch.com.
Posted by: Max Main Mar 19 2007, 01:35 PM
sad case.
Posted by: Ang Mar 20 2007, 03:23 PM
Max, I agree that it is sad. It pains me that Chuck has taken such drastic measures. He really is a good guy, but when his wife left him and took their son, it devastated him. It was something that he just couldn't recover from. He loved Cindi and he loved his son with all of heart. Chuck and Neb were "best friends" and when Cindi took him away, Chuck died inside. I wish that he could've gotten the help he needed to prevent this tragedy and my heart goes out to all the people he has hurt. I will keep Chuck in my prayers in the hope that he will return to Michigan City and take responsibility for his actions.
Posted by: Tim Mar 20 2007, 04:58 PM
Jeez, I hope Chuck didn't drive to California. 
While it's easy to poke fun, substance abuse/addiction is a horrible illness that can render the best of us idiots. I knew Chuck a long time ago - and I share Ang's hope that he seeks help.
Posted by: JHeath Mar 20 2007, 09:24 PM
I attended tonight's council meeting--Mr. Lungren is resigning from the Council effective immediately.
This should be interesting to see who replaces him for the duration of his term.
Posted by: southsider2k7 Mar 21 2007, 05:11 AM
It should be interesting to say the least. The eighth district has been facinating with all of the people in and out all over the place. A position like this could give someone a big leg up in the general election, because potentially it gives someone free face time in front of the City.
Posted by: Max Main Mar 21 2007, 11:04 AM
While alcoholism has characteristics of disease, it really is not a Medical condition per se, but it generates medical conditions.
At any rate, Mr. Lundgren is a good-hearted man, as far as I have known him, and he does have contributions to make to his family and the city. Unfortunately, he cannot as long as he does not become and stay sober.
I hope he does get the help and support he needs to do so.
Posted by: southsider2k7 Mar 21 2007, 01:38 PM
http://www.michigancityin.com/articles/2007/03/21/news/n2.txt
By Jason Miller, The News-Dispatch
Embattled First Ward Michigan City Councilman Chuck Lungren, apparently on the run from the law since last week, resigned from the council this week according to a letter delivered, council members said, by Lungren's brother.
According to council vice president Ron Meer, the letter - turned in to the city controller's office - said, in short, “I hereby resign my position on the Michigan City Common Council, effective immediately.”
Lungren was arrested March 5 in Plymouth on his third drunk driving charge in just over two years. He missed his court date on March 13, Marshall County officials said, and is now wanted on a felony warrant for failure to appear in court.
A friend of Lungren's told The News-Dispatch last week that Lungren fled to California to live with a sister.
Council Attorney Jim Meyer said Tuesday copies of Lungren's letter are required to be given to the city clerk, the local election board and the county Democratic chairman.
Democratic precinct committee people from the First Ward will have to hold a caucus to pick a replacement for Lungren. The caucus could occur within weeks of the May primary election, for which Lungren chose not to file. He said last month he planned to move to California after his term expired.
Meer said the future of the First Ward seat is now out of the council's hands.
“Whether (precinct committee people) wait until after the primary, I don't know,” he said. “My guess is they'll see who wins the primary, then appoint that person.
“Who I really feel bad for are his constituents. There's no one championing their causes now.”
Posted by: Ang Mar 21 2007, 04:04 PM
I'm glad everyone here is mildly supportive of Chuck. He is getting ripped to shreds over at the ND Feedback. After the last time I threw my two-cents in over Chuck, I've decided to stay out of this time. But, it's nice that the people here are sympathetic and understanding.
Posted by: Tim Mar 21 2007, 04:16 PM
While alcoholism has characteristics of disease, it really is not a Medical condition per se, but it generates medical conditions.
At any rate, Mr. Lundgren is a good-hearted man, as far as I have known him, and he does have contributions to make to his family and the city. Unfortunately, he cannot as long as he does not become and stay sober.
I hope he does get the help and support he needs to do so.
Alcoholism not a disease? Wrong
From :http://alcoholism.about.com/cs/about/f/faq2.htm
Q. Is Alcoholism a Disease?
From National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism
A. Yes. Alcoholism is a chronic, often progressive disease with symptoms that include a strong need to drink despite negative consequences, such as serious job or health problems. Like many other diseases, it has a generally predictable course, has recognized symptoms, and is influenced by both genetic and environmental factors that are being increasingly well defined. (See also Alcohol Alert No. 30: Diagnostic Criteria for Alcohol Abuse and Dependence.)
Please - get your facts straight.
Posted by: Max Main Mar 21 2007, 05:00 PM
it is not pc to disagree with the alcoholism is a disease crowd. but i do. but it does not really matter in either case. the effects can be horrific, and alcoholics need help.
Posted by: Tim Mar 21 2007, 05:05 PM
it is not pc to disagree with the alcoholism is a disease crowd. but i do. but it does not really matter in either case. the effects can be horrific, and alcoholics need help.
There's nothing to agree or disagree about. Alcoholism is a disease. Period.
Posted by: Max Main Mar 22 2007, 09:13 AM
Nope.
Cool avatar.
Posted by: southsider2k7 Mar 22 2007, 09:31 AM
I'm glad everyone here is mildly supportive of Chuck. He is getting ripped to shreds over at the ND Feedback. After the last time I threw my two-cents in over Chuck, I've decided to stay out of this time. But, it's nice that the people here are sympathetic and understanding.
As a new father, I can't help but feel for his situation. That being said, there aren't many dumber things that you can do than driving while intoxicated. You are literally putting yourself behind a one ton missle at that point. I do hope that he gets his life together and gets the help he needs.
Posted by: Max Main Mar 22 2007, 09:58 AM
I agree with the 'war' against drunk driving. I always told my kids that if they needed a ride because they had been drinking (against my expressed instructions, by the way) or whoever was driving was drunk, to call me and I would cheerfully get them home safely, and anyone they were with, too. Parents are too permissive about teen drinking, it seems, and many kids are loaded behind the wheel. God help them.
Posted by: Ang Mar 22 2007, 11:14 AM
I agree with the 'war' against drunk driving. I always told my kids that if they needed a ride because they had been drinking (against my expressed instructions, by the way) or whoever was driving was drunk, to call me and I would cheerfully get them home safely, and anyone they were with, too. Parents are too permissive about teen drinking, it seems, and many kids are loaded behind the wheel. God help them.
I agree with you Max--on this point--and I've told my teenage son the same thing. I am lucky that he does not drink though. There is a reason for that.
Alcoholism runs in my family (another characteristic of a Disease) and my son watched his grandma die from cirrhosis of the liver due to severe alcoholism. It was a very traumatic thing for us, but my son learned the dangers of drinking on the physical body. I've been able to avoid the disease and I pray my children will, too. But, it's not been easy for me. I've learned the best thing for me is to not drink at all, or only on special occasions. It takes a lot of willpower though, let me tell ya.
I do agree with Tim that alcoholism is a disease. It leaves genetic markers and can affect future generations. However, not all alcoholics have the predisposition for it. Some are created by their environment or society.
So, Max, why do you feel alcoholism is not a disease and what do you think it is?
Posted by: Max Main Mar 22 2007, 01:49 PM
For one thing, there is no immune system response like there is to viruses, bacteria, fungi, protozoa, and so forth. If you do not imbibe, there is no 'illness.'
Posted by: Tim Mar 22 2007, 04:23 PM
Nope.
Cool avatar.
Yep. Type "Is alcoholism a disease?" into Yahoo or Google and let us know what you find. It's a disease.
Posted by: Ang Mar 22 2007, 05:12 PM
the illness comes from the urge to drink, not wanting to drink and not being able to stop. Alcoholism is a disease that affects the psyche, but there is physical symptoms as well. Especially when the alcoholic doesn't "imbibe." Trust me. I'm not making this up. An alcoholic can become physically ill if they don't drink. Granted, it is mostly psychological, but the symptoms are there. You may joke and say, "Oh that feeling is a Hang-over." but I'm talking about when they haven't drank for a while. And there is medication that one can take to relieve the physical symptoms and help to get past the psychological symptoms. But the urge is ALWAYS there and it's a constant battle to fight it. It takes huge amounts of will power.
Webster says:
One entry found for alcoholism.
Main Entry: al·co·hol·ism
Pronunciation: 'al-k&-"ho-"li-z&m, -k&-h&-
Function: noun
1 : continued excessive or compulsive use of alcoholic drinks
2 a : poisoning by alcohol b : a chronic disorder marked by excessive and usually compulsive drinking of alcohol leading to psychological and physical dependence or addiction
And Britannica says (in part) http://www.britannica.com/eb/article-9110089/alcoholism:
Encyclopædia Britannica Article
Page 1 of 13
Excessive and repetitive drinking of alcoholic beverages to the extent that the drinker repeatedly is harmed or harms others. The harm may be physical or mental; it may also be social, legal, or economic. Because such use is usually considered to be compulsive and under markedly diminished voluntary control, alcoholism is considered by a majority of, but not all, clinicians as an addiction and a disease. ...
Now growing up in school we were taught that Mirriam-Webster and Encyclopedia Britannica were LAW. So, alcoholism IS a desease.
Posted by: Max Main Mar 23 2007, 12:39 PM
Alcoholism leads to physical illness, of course; no one can deny that. But you do not `catch' alcoholism even if you have the predisposition toward it. In neither citation is alcoholism defined as a disease; EB merely says that most not all clinicians call it that.
Merriam-Webster is the dictionary of choice; I agree with you there. Note that their def. does not say "disease."
I maintain that it is a pc conceit to call alcoholism a disease.
Posted by: Tim Mar 23 2007, 05:06 PM
Alcoholism leads to physical illness, of course; no one can deny that. But you do not `catch' alcoholism even if you have the predisposition toward it. In neither citation is alcoholism defined as a disease; EB merely says that most not all clinicians call it that.
Merriam-Webster is the dictionary of choice; I agree with you there. Note that their def. does not say "disease."
I maintain that it is a pc conceit to call alcoholism a disease.
That's an interesting opinion, but the entire medical community calls alcoholism a disease - so I'll go with that.
Posted by: Max Main Mar 28 2007, 12:09 PM
It is not unanimous.
Posted by: Tim Mar 28 2007, 09:13 PM
It is not unanimous.
Whatever.
Posted by: Max Main Mar 29 2007, 08:03 AM
The point is that a lot of people excuse their behavior or have it excused for them by using the alcoholism-as-disease ploy, as if they were like Parkinson's victims who knock over a glasses. Those addicted to alcohol develop into alcoholics; they are not born as alcoholics. Alcohol, and indirectly, alcoholism, used to be a defense when someone did something horrible, like run over a person. I just have heard too many people try to do the essentially same thing by defining alcoholics as victims rather than victimisers.
Posted by: Ang Mar 29 2007, 03:31 PM
Good point Max
Posted by: Tim Mar 29 2007, 04:24 PM
The point is that a lot of people excuse their behavior or have it excused for them by using the alcoholism-as-disease ploy,
You think that makes it not a disease?
Nope.
People who get lung cancer from smoking and die from it were not born with lung cancer either.
Posted by: Tim Mar 29 2007, 10:06 PM
From http://www.physiciansnews.com/commentary/298wp.html
"During the past 35 years, numerous studies by behavioral and social scientists have supported Jellinek’s contentions about alcoholism as a disease. The American Medical Association endorsed the concept in 1957. The American Psychiatric Association, the American Hospital Association, the American Public Health Association, the National Association of Social Workers, the World Health Organization and the American College of Physicians have also classified alcoholism as a disease.
In a 1992 JAMA article, the Joint Committee of the National Council on Alcoholism and Drug Dependence and the American Society of Addiction Medicine published this definition for alcoholism: "Alcoholism is a primary chronic disease with genetic, psychosocial, and environmental factors influencing its development and manifestations. The disease is often progressive and fatal.
Alcoholism should not be judged as a problem of willpower, misconduct, or any other unscientific diagnosis. The problem must be accepted for what it is—a biopsychosocial disease with a strong genetic influence, obvious signs and symptoms, a natural progression and a fatal outcome if not treated."
Posted by: Max Main Apr 2 2007, 08:18 AM
Aapparently the initial experiences with alcohol should be revelatory. How are the partiers from high school doing? Any of them recognized alcoholics as adults? Yes, some that I know.
Is it a disease? It may be a question of when you identify a person as an alcoholic. Is the partier who gives up heavy drinking as an adult still an alcoholic?
Is this JAMA's latest word on def. of alc.?
Posted by: Tim Apr 2 2007, 07:25 PM
Aapparently the initial experiences with alcohol should be revelatory. How are the partiers from high school doing? Any of them recognized alcoholics as adults? Yes, some that I know.
Is it a disease? It may be a question of when you identify a person as an alcoholic. Is the partier who gives up heavy drinking as an adult still an alcoholic?
Is this JAMA's latest word on def. of alc.?
Good questions. And in researching that quote I found that there certainly is a school of thought on the "not disease" side of the equation. To be frank, I found your "pc conceit" (I don't even know what that is) offensive - as if I'm calling alcoholism a disease be cause it's some kind of "party mantra". Then again, they say you're always an alcoholic - is that true? I still feel - strongly - that alcoholism is a disease - as does most of the medical community.
Posted by: Max Main Apr 3 2007, 11:30 AM
It is a very interesting questions, whether one is always an alcoholic. Does this imply that one is an alcoholic before one begins to drink--and the alcohol just allows this condition to emerge? And what about the high school partier who does not drink as an adult? Is that person, an admitted alcoholic in HS, STILL an alcoholic as an adult?
Posted by: Ang Apr 3 2007, 11:50 AM
Children of alcoholics have a predisposition to become alcoholics themselves. I think that is why some people classify it as a disease. There are genetic markers, so they say. My thought regarding the high school student; If the kid who drinks in high school goes on the wagon and never drinks again after graduation, then he was just a kid who liked to party in high school. But, if that child gets arrested many times as an MIP, starts showing up to school drunk, fails classes and does not graduate, then they have a drinking problem and could be considered an alcoholic-especially if they don't quit drinking after high school.
My question is this, "if a child is born of an alcoholic mother who got knocked up by an alcoholic man, is given away for adoption and rasied by two caring people who have never drank and never exposed the child to alcohol, will that child still grow up to be an alcoholic?" Tim, Max, what do you guys think?
Posted by: Tim Apr 3 2007, 07:49 PM
It is a very interesting questions, whether one is always an alcoholic. Does this imply that one is an alcoholic before one begins to drink--and the alcohol just allows this condition to emerge? And what about the high school partier who does not drink as an adult? Is that person, an admitted alcoholic in HS, STILL an alcoholic as an adult?
But is the high schooler who drinks really an alcoholic?
Too many questions beyond my somewhat limited scope of knowledge! In the early 80's I had a three-year cocaine addiction - and was what anyone would call an alcoholic. Am I one now? I don't think so. I drink - responsibly, and I don't NEED it or feel I can't face life without it. So - I can honestly say I don't know. Regarding the question of disease, I think Alcoholism is a disease. Beyond, I don't really know.
My question is this, "if a child is born of an alcoholic mother who got knocked up by an alcoholic man, is given away for adoption and rasied by two caring people who have never drank and never exposed the child to alcohol, will that child still grow up to be an alcoholic?" Tim, Max, what do you guys think?
I think the child will still be genetically inclined to become an alcoholic. But not all children of alcoholics become alcoholics - so I'd just say that child would be at greater risk.
Posted by: Max Main Apr 4 2007, 10:37 AM
Inclination, probably. Let's assume that the adoptive parents' teaching stay with the child, then the child goes away to college (State Party U.), attends a kegger or two. Will that child still be more inclined to become an alcoholic? I think it depends a LOT on the surrounding circumstances: social pressure, maturity, peer models, etc. I think that those surrounding circumstances can overcome the parental training. I wonder if there are any credible studies regarding this.
In the case of Mr Lundgren, I do not know his family background, don't know how he was raised w/ re to drinking, and I do't know who he hung out with. What is the latest on him? Is he still absconding, in Cal. I think?
Powered by Invision Power Board (http://www.invisionboard.com)
© Invision Power Services (http://www.invisionpower.com)