[Homey]

Thanks Ang...you understand me!

I remember in high school, there was so much school spirit, regular dances that everyone went to. There were teenage hangouts, like Hilltop on the corner by the high school. No cops. No cops were needed. The Barn on the Boulevard who hosted bands from Chicago..and you could walk down the Boulevard and not be scared or attacked.

All the great stores downtown, even at Marquette Mall...really good stores.

The Casino is ok as a draw..but I hate Casino's. I go to some of the festivals...during the day. I don't know what I'm trying to pin point, I guess it's just an overall feeling of being uninfranchised.

[Johnny Rush]

From talking about this on-air and some emails that we got. I have to wonder how much if this is influenced by the way different regions interpret and answer questions. People in this area almost seem to brag about how "unhealthy" they are, and I am guilty of this as well. The whole, I'll out drink/out smoke/out eat you type attitude seems to be generally accepted here...but may be looked down upon in most other regions. That would explain why we would be dead last in Healthy Behavior, while being middle of the pack in actual physical health. Wouldn't it stand to reason that if this area ACTUALLY had the worst behaviors when it came to abusing diet/excercise/smoking etc...that we would be feeling the effects in some way or another? Are we being protected by some kinda hidden nutrient in the Lake Michigan water that makes non-healthy behavior keep us healthy? Different regions may be "sneaking cigarettes" or maybe their "closet junk food junkies", because it is viewed as socially unacceptable elsewhere and is tolerated if not applauded here.


Plus I have noticed that if you ask someone from around here what is wrong...they'll tell you what is wrong. I can't help but think that maybe someone from Utah or a similiar place may give an oh gosh, no complaints type answer where as we'll "shoot it to ya straight". People here seem just as happy and as proud of our area as anywhere else I've visited...'course I've pretty much spent my entire life in NW Indiana except for a stint at Purdue...so I may not be the one to give an answer. I just like to think that we have fewer taboos and feel more free/open to complain or "brag about bad behavior" than the rest of the states.

[Homey]

I agree with you. We know that Indiana has one of the highest obesity rates and probably lead the U.S. in social acceptance of smoking. I don't know why this is acceptable to the majority. But look at our restaurants for example. Can we tolerate another McDonalds, Taco Bell or pizza place in town? Maybe so if most think of this as fine dining.

[IndyTransplant]

Thanks Ang...you understand me!

I remember in high school, there was so much school spirit, regular dances that everyone went to. There were teenage hangouts, like Hilltop on the corner by the high school. No cops. No cops were needed. The Barn on the Boulevard who hosted bands from Chicago..and you could walk down the Boulevard and not be scared or attacked.

All the great stores downtown, even at Marquette Mall...really good stores.

The Casino is ok as a draw..but I hate Casino's. I go to some of the festivals...during the day. I don't know what I'm trying to pin point, I guess it's just an overall feeling of being uninfranchised.

I understand too. I spent all of my growing up years prior to about 16 in Columbus, Indiana and there was (and probably still is) a similar spirit there.....at least for high schoolers. We moved to Indy my mid high school years because my mother had a stroke and needed to be cared for - all of her physical therapy and doctors were out of Methodist Hospital in Indianapolis. Believe me....... moving mid high school can cause an abrupt feeling of disenfranchisement.

Part of the feeling you have comes with growing up and away from the best friends many people make (in HS or college) and the sense of community with belonging to a school.
But that is not all of it. Additional costs come with growing up and feeling for ourselves the weight of financial and parental pressures ( the part of living that our parents shielded from us when we were young) and face it ,,,,the world in general is more financially unstable and more crime ridden than in our youth. Businesses close, governments change, etc. That has happened everywhere, not just MC.

Other things changed along the way too....everyone went to work. Most mothers were not home as much to care for their own children. Most neighbors never had a chance to meet and socialize or were just plain old too tired when they got home from work. My parents were in card clubs with neighbors and went to school events with other parents. When my children were young, the friends I made were with their schoolmates' parents. Once the children all grew up and away, so did the adults.

But the feeling of disenfranchisement is mostly our own fault. It is up to us to create and keep our home base; up to us to find or create activities that we enjoy as adults and along the way find groups of others who enjoy the same things. If you would still enjoy HS sports - go the games, talk to the other adults and meet those you don't know. Become familiar with the players and root for them. (I chose the Pacers as my team, once I moved to Indy as I no longer had a HS team I could relate to. Of course this was in the days when the Pacers actually played as a team and not the Pacers of the last several years. lol ).

I do go to the casino as I love to play cards. But that is just something for me....not for everyone. When I first moved here, the poker room there offered me an opportunity to play cards and meet people. Some of those people I now consider friends. It is even harder for a newcomer to the area, so this was the first thing I tried. I totally understand those who do not like the casino....but there is so much more to do in MC annd there are always things you can do in your own home.

I love board games and cards. I love going to the movies with friends. I love sitting around, enjoying good food and drink and talking about anything. I belong to a non-academic sorority because I like working together with other women for common goals. If anyone out there is interested in any of these things and is feeling disenfranchised, email me and we will see if we can get a group together to do one or some of these things together.

It is not easy, but it never was.

[kapkomet]

From talking about this on-air and some emails that we got. I have to wonder how much if this is influenced by the way different regions interpret and answer questions. People in this area almost seem to brag about how "unhealthy" they are, and I am guilty of this as well. The whole, I'll out drink/out smoke/out eat you type attitude seems to be generally accepted here...but may be looked down upon in most other regions. That would explain why we would be dead last in Healthy Behavior, while being middle of the pack in actual physical health. Wouldn't it stand to reason that if this area ACTUALLY had the worst behaviors when it came to abusing diet/excercise/smoking etc...that we would be feeling the effects in some way or another? Are we being protected by some kinda hidden nutrient in the Lake Michigan water that makes non-healthy behavior keep us healthy? Different regions may be "sneaking cigarettes" or maybe their "closet junk food junkies", because it is viewed as socially unacceptable elsewhere and is tolerated if not applauded here.
Plus I have noticed that if you ask someone from around here what is wrong...they'll tell you what is wrong. I can't help but think that maybe someone from Utah or a similiar place may give an oh gosh, no complaints type answer where as we'll "shoot it to ya straight". People here seem just as happy and as proud of our area as anywhere else I've visited...'course I've pretty much spent my entire life in NW Indiana except for a stint at Purdue...so I may not be the one to give an answer. I just like to think that we have fewer taboos and feel more free/open to complain or "brag about bad behavior" than the rest of the states.

You bring up some good points here.

When we did surveys like this on a nationwide basis in my MBA program, we had to be very careful about "regional bias"... you hit it when you said a question will get one answer in one part of the country and another part of the country will mean exactly the same thing as in place A but say it totally different.

You have to be careful when you write these questions to try and ensure you don't get that bias.

I do think that some places will try and sugar coat their "bads", if you will. People in the Chicago area are completely and sometimes brutally honest.

IndyTransplant, forgive me, and I don't mean to sound harsh... I have spent a lot of time in Chicago, MC, Indianapolis, Fort Wayne, and other little towns in Indiana. NW Indiana has a totally different personality then Indianapolis. There's two reasons for that. NW Indiana is a lot more blue collar. They are a hardened group of people who have been pretty much shafted on industry and other situations (read: steel). Also, Indianapolis honestly is a city that has grown through a lot different means then did Chicago.

In addition, there's no way you can put Indianapolis and Chicago even on the same playing field. The attitudes, people, the way things are done, are completely different. I do think that introduces bias into some of the questions ... as Johnny brought up.

People here in Dallas/Fort Worth are pretty open about things as well, but it's yet even different then Chicago or Indianapolis. They're direct (most of the time) but they tend to twang their answers a bit... (oh what a pun) in that they try to sound sophisticated when they're not. I don't know how else to say that. I'll try to explain it better if it's confusing.

My original premise that MC is someplace that could do some golden things with the proper investment stands. You have to change the attitudes, and it starts with the 10-12 year olds and their parents. You change that, you change a city.

[Michelle]

Wouldn't it stand to reason that if this area ACTUALLY had the worst behaviors when it came to abusing diet/excercise/smoking etc...that we would be feeling the effects in some way or another?

So you don't think we're just protected by some anti-illness forcefield surrounding the city? This seemed like the most telling bit of data to me too; that (collectively) what we say we are doesn't match up to reality. It looks like a negative bias in the reporting.

Still, thinking that a lot of the people I'm interacting with every day think that they're living the *worst life possible* is bumming me out a bit too. Sure, I've noticed some complaining. It's true that some people don't recognize all the good things here that are right before their eyes. But to think that we're basically the most miserable people in the country? I dunno...a lot of people I see around seem relatively happy. Wow. I might just be Little Miss Happypants and extrapolating from my own experience, but it just doesn't seem to add up.

[Michelle]

Other things changed along the way too....everyone went to work. Most mothers were not home as much to care for their own children. Most neighbors never had a chance to meet and socialize or were just plain old too tired when they got home from work. My parents were in card clubs with neighbors and went to school events with other parents. When my children were young, the friends I made were with their schoolmates' parents. Once the children all grew up and away, so did the adults.

This makes a lot of sense. The world has changed, but it's not just here--it's everywhere. DAR chapters and garden clubs are dying everywhere for lack of time and energy. And people are more mobile now. They don't always stay in the town where they grew up, and thus don't have that connection to the high schools & such of their new home towns. But it's not all bad; there are different forms of community sprouting up in the new world (this forum is an easy example). I wonder also if we remember the good things about the past more clearly than the challenging parts...especially if, as IT/Pollyanna says, we're remembering from the relatively carefree days of childhood.

If anyone out there is interested in any of these things and is feeling disenfranchised, email me and we will see if we can get a group together to do one or some of these things together.

I'll second this too. If anyone wants to get together for a card game/board game/b-dub trivia/etc night, I'm all ears. Let's attack this misery and anti-community feeling on the home front!

[Homey]

You bring up some good points here.

When we did surveys like this on a nationwide basis in my MBA program, we had to be very careful about "regional bias"... you hit it when you said a question will get one answer in one part of the country and another part of the country will mean exactly the same thing as in place A but say it totally different.

You have to be careful when you write these questions to try and ensure you don't get that bias.

I do think that some places will try and sugar coat their "bads", if you will. People in the Chicago area are completely and sometimes brutally honest.

IndyTransplant, forgive me, and I don't mean to sound harsh... I have spent a lot of time in Chicago, MC, Indianapolis, Fort Wayne, and other little towns in Indiana. NW Indiana has a totally different personality then Indianapolis. There's two reasons for that. NW Indiana is a lot more blue collar. They are a hardened group of people who have been pretty much shafted on industry and other situations (read: steel). Also, Indianapolis honestly is a city that has grown through a lot different means then did Chicago.

In addition, there's no way you can put Indianapolis and Chicago even on the same playing field. The attitudes, people, the way things are done, are completely different. I do think that introduces bias into some of the questions ... as Johnny brought up.

People here in Dallas/Fort Worth are pretty open about things as well, but it's yet even different then Chicago or Indianapolis. They're direct (most of the time) but they tend to twang their answers a bit... (oh what a pun) in that they try to sound sophisticated when they're not. I don't know how else to say that. I'll try to explain it better if it's confusing.

My original premise that MC is someplace that could do some golden things with the proper investment stands. You have to change the attitudes, and it starts with the 10-12 year olds and their parents. You change that, you change a city.

Very good points here. My DS lived in Indy for a few years and found it different from us up here. Now he lives in Chicago. He'll never come back to M.C. except for visits. He believes he has escaped the blue collar mentality here. Now please don't get your panties in an uproar. I'm not diminishing M.C...just trying to relate.
I think M.C. isn't what it use to be and could be so much better than it currently is. With the assets we have, we should be more interesting and vital.

[IndyTransplant]

IndyTransplant, forgive me, and I don't mean to sound harsh... I have spent a lot of time in Chicago, MC, Indianapolis, Fort Wayne, and other little towns in Indiana. NW Indiana has a totally different personality then Indianapolis. There's two reasons for that. NW Indiana is a lot more blue collar. They are a hardened group of people who have been pretty much shafted on industry and other situations (read: steel). Also, Indianapolis honestly is a city that has grown through a lot different means then did Chicago.

In addition, there's no way you can put Indianapolis and Chicago even on the same playing field. The attitudes, people, the way things are done, are completely different. I do think that introduces bias into some of the questions ... as Johnny brought up.

OOOOH I have been misunderstood. . I was not equating Indianapolis and Chicago. They are not equal and not the same. However I disagree with you about the people. The people are not completely different. In general, people are people everywhere. What may be different is the way the people present themselves to outsiders - which goes along with Johnny's post.

However I think many of you do not understand or know Indianapolis well either, which is part of the reason I brought up my thought. Indianapolis is a small town (or bunch of small towns) encompassed in a larger city name. Because of that many of the state's residents (outside Indianapolis) do not understand the real Indianapolis. Most people visit downtown Indianapolis or the north side and equate Indianapolis with that image. But that image is not the majority. I will grant you that Indianapolis over the last twenty five years has done an excellent job of reinventing it's image.....such a good job that you all believe it. You certainly can't fault their ability to market an image.(Which will bring me back to my point later).

Blue collar - Indianapolis? Allisons, Navistar, Chrysler, Ford, Eli Lilly and more than you can name. All companies with workers who were shafted on industry, as you call it. Absolutely a lot of blue collar - particularly the south and west sides of Indianapolis.....and no less hardened than the sturdy folks in NW Indiana. My husband was a blue collar worker all of his life and he is an original Indianapolis native. Unfortunately (or fortunately for the image Indianapolis likes to present to the world) when you read the papers and watch the tv, you do not often see stories of the south or west sides (which encompasses one half of the population).

You might have read one story in the last few years, a story that southsiders followed with interest....the story of David taking on Goliath. David was an old small manufacturing company called Hurst Beans, located on the near southside inconveniently in the way of of a Goliath called Lucas Oil Stadium. Hurst Beans has employed generation after generation of southsiders. It is a family company and a good company to work for. To make a long story short, Hurst Beans and Lucas Oil Stadium ended up in a protracted fight that was in and out of courts and negotiations for quite a while. Based on how the court cases (and the very vocal southside opinion) were going, a compromise was reached. The same compromise that Hurst Beans had offered originally. To southsiders, it was one of the biggest victories in memory. This came after the larger manufacturers like Allisons, Ford and other plants had laid off, closed down or moved out. It was at about the same time as Eli Lilly laying off employees and hiring contract workers instead.

By the same token, Chicago is also a city made up of many small towns. The biggest difference being that it's older, bigger and it's center is much larger than the whole of Indianapolis. They are not the same and I would not want them to be same. I was not suggesting that NW Indiana should more closely relate to Indianapolis. I was suggesting that NW Indiana should not shun, ignore or run from Indianapolis. My main idea was that a place like MC should market itself throughout the state (starting with Indianapolis, as they have the largest market area in the state). After all Chicago already has what Michigan City can offer. However Indianapolis and central/southern Indiana do not. You market your assets most successfully to places who do not share your assets.

That is all.

[kapkomet]

I get what you're saying. Indianapolis was originally a blure collar town, I would agree. I've spent a lot of time on the south side of town (Beech Grove, Southport, etc.). Those are two neighborhoods/towns that are pretty blue collar even now. And IIRC, the attitude in pockets there are roughly the same as in MC.

Is that to say that blue collar folks have the same tendencies and attitudes because the fabric of what they've done all their life is being ripped apart right before their eyes? It's just a question - one I'm curious if the original survey addresses as you look at the results.

[IndyTransplant]

I get what you're saying. Indianapolis was originally a blure collar town, I would agree. I've spent a lot of time on the south side of town (Beech Grove, Southport, etc.). Those are two neighborhoods/towns that are pretty blue collar even now. And IIRC, the attitude in pockets there are roughly the same as in MC.

Is that to say that blue collar folks have the same tendencies and attitudes because the fabric of what they've done all their life is being ripped apart right before their eyes? It's just a question - one I'm curious if the original survey addresses as you look at the results.

Thank you for understanding. That is a good question also.

The original survey does not denote the same attitude for south side or any area of Indy as it does for MC. That does not mean the attitude does not exist, just that it is diluted.

The congressional districts in Indianapolis cross over too many different areas and types of neighborhoods. We lived on the SE side of Indy prior to moving to MC. Our congressional district included a small part of Indianapolis (Marion County), and parts of Shelby, Hancock and Johnson Counties. That is a pretty diverse congressional district encompassing blue collar, white collar, farmers and many retirees; wealthy, middle class & poor; whites, blacks and in recent years growing populations of hispanic immigrants. The only Indianapolis area congressional district that is comprised only of Marion County residents (and even this was a diverse district) was Julia Carson's (now Andre Carson's) district. The others extend out to include other counties and other areas.

[Southsider2k12]

Interesting discussion all around. I hadn't really thought about the angle of people not adjusting to the life style changes that have hit our area in the last two generations. This used to be a total manufacturing and industry town. Now we are a tourist town. That is about as big of a 180 as you can imagine.

[kapkomet]

There are also a ton of competing things for people's time now compared to even 20 years ago. What did people do with their time? We went to basketball games and were CRAZY (hehe) there. Now, we sit and watch HD tv and play video games along with the internet.

We are in a much more complacent society now then we were in, and how does that add to the line of questioning? I think it depends on what you look at.

[IndyTransplant]

Interesting discussion all around. I hadn't really thought about the angle of people not adjusting to the life style changes that have hit our area in the last two generations. This used to be a total manufacturing and industry town. Now we are a tourist town. That is about as big of a 180 as you can imagine.

It is a good point and may hit the nail on the head. Because of the erosion of the manufacturing and farming base in Indiana, people all over are having to reinvent themselves. Although there may be more opportunities for this in a larger city like Indianapolis or Chicago, there are still opportunities currently here in MC. I also believe that the city, county and state governments (whether Democrat or Republican) really are trying to enhance those opportunities as they can. (The problem with governments of course is the constant bickering over what is the right way to do that. ) Shoot, we even bicker about that in this forum.

MC, as you stated, is now more of a tourist town. IMO, (even in the current economic downturn and maybe even because of the economic downturn), this offers MC residents an expanding opportunity to use that as a basis for reinventing themselves. There are also opportunities in the vast areas of schooling and training offered in and around MC. Training in other areas may also help attract other opportunities to us.

The biggest problem may be, that we, as adults have a harder time adjusting to change or even forcing ourselves to make the personal or career changes needed. But we can do it.
I have been forced into reinventing myself several times over now . I never like doing it and I always think it will be temporary and someday I will return to a previous career. What is that saying...."Nothing is more permanent than something that is temporary" .
The other saying that often comes to mind also fits the concept of having to reinvent ourselves.
"Necessity (or need) is the mother of invention" or in this case re-invention.

[Southsider2k12]

It is a good point and may hit the nail on the head. Because of the erosion of the manufacturing and farming base in Indiana, people all over are having to reinvent themselves. Although there may be more opportunities for this in a larger city like Indianapolis or Chicago, there are still opportunities currently here in MC. I also believe that the city, county and state governments (whether Democrat or Republican) really are trying to enhance those opportunities as they can. (The problem with governments of course is the constant bickering over what is the right way to do that. ) Shoot, we even bicker about that in this forum.

MC, as you stated, is now more of a tourist town. IMO, (even in the current economic downturn and maybe even because of the economic downturn), this offers MC residents an expanding opportunity to use that as a basis for reinventing themselves. There are also opportunities in the vast areas of schooling and training offered in and around MC. Training in other areas may also help attract other opportunities to us.

The biggest problem may be, that we, as adults have a harder time adjusting to change or even forcing ourselves to make the personal or career changes needed. But we can do it.
I have been forced into reinventing myself several times over now . I never like doing it and I always think it will be temporary and someday I will return to a previous career. What is that saying...."Nothing is more permanent than something that is temporary" .
The other saying that often comes to mind also fits the concept of having to reinvent ourselves.
"Necessity (or need) is the mother of invention" or in this case re-invention.

To me the scariest part of this area isn't the people who want to fight and argue about what to do, its the amount of people who have completely given up on the process and are doing nothing to try to improve life around them. I might not agree with some of the changes that have been proposed, but I do appreciate the people trying to move the community forward into a better situation. I can't understand the people who are miserable here and complete content to wallow in self-pity about it.

[Southsider2k12]

I also missed one thing that I wanted to mention, Chicago and Indy couldn't be more opposite. I have been born and raised with a solid Chicago influence. While I was born and raised in MC except for a few years in Houston from 7-10 years old, and my years of college, my family is originally from Chicago a couple of generations back. The four years I spent in college, I was in Indianapolis a lot, and the region I was in definitely had a solid Indy influence. I didn't like it down there at all. In general, I didn't like the way people who were different were looked at. I had multiple job offers in that area after college, and moved back home to a more comfortable environment. This region of the country is way more honest and open. Some people take it for rudeness, but I wouldn't have it any other way. You almost always know where you stand with people from this part of the country.

[Ang]

.... You almost always know where you stand with people from this part of the country.

AMEN Brother! That is my biggest pet peeve about living where I do is that I never really know where I stand with people. They're so secretive. Why? Just say it man. That's my philosophy.

[IndyTransplant]

I also missed one thing that I wanted to mention, Chicago and Indy couldn't be more opposite. I have been born and raised with a solid Chicago influence. While I was born and raised in MC except for a few years in Houston from 7-10 years old, and my years of college, my family is originally from Chicago a couple of generations back. The four years I spent in college, I was in Indianapolis a lot, and the region I was in definitely had a solid Indy influence. I didn't like it down there at all. In general, I didn't like the way people who were different were looked at. I had multiple job offers in that area after college, and moved back home to a more comfortable environment. This region of the country is way more honest and open. Some people take it for rudeness, but I wouldn't have it any other way. You almost always know where you stand with people from this part of the country.

I am sorry you did not like Indianapolis. I am also sorry you based your opinion on your college years (4) when it sounds like you did not actually live there, but may have gone to college near there?
I lived there for 35 years and lived in several different neighborhoods and sides of town and loved the different experiences and different types of people this allowed me to interact with and learn from. Basically, your feelings about Indianapolis based on your 4 college years are influenced by what years those consisted of and what areas of Indianapolis you spent time in. Where did you go to college, when and what areas of Indy did you visit?

In particular your comment of "In general, I didn't like the way people who were different were looked at." totally surprises me. In what way were you or anyone else different? Indianapolis consists of wealthy, middle class and poor; Whites, Blacks, Asians, Hispanics and Middle Easterners; old, young and middle aged people. Indianapolis is actually influenced by its status as a transplant city - people from all parts of the country and many immigrants have moved to and are now part of Indianapolis.
Your comment above, followed by this comment also confuses me. "I had multiple job offers in that area after college, and moved back home to a more comfortable environment. This region of the country is way more honest and open. Some people take it for rudeness, but I wouldn't have it any other way." It appears that some of that not liking the way "people who were different were looked at" was coming from your own self. You did not like the people in or around Indy that you perceived to be different from you. I really am not trying to be argumentative or rude, but these two statements have me totally confused.

IMO, Indianapolis is one of the largest small towns in America. It has the friendliness of a small town and the advantages of being one of the top twenty largest cities in this country. It is an unusual combination and I loved it.

Indianapolis has gone through some major changes over the last twenty years. It has rightfully shed its original image of Naptown and has expanded its entertainment, culture and business image and is still trying to do so (this at a time when some other cities are decaying and losing their downtowns).

No, Indianapolis is not Chicago and never will be.....it will never be able to offer the amount of entertainment, business and culture that Chicago does. By sheer size alone, it will never offer the amount of diversity Chicago offers. Indianapolis has less than 1 million people and Chicago has more than 5x that.

However (and this is a separate point) I do not think there is one Chicago "influence" nor is there one Indy "influence". Both these cities are made of of neighborhoods with different influences. Knowing several people in both cities who live in many different areas of both cities, you will get opinions based on where they live, work or visit. Even without going into specific neighborhoods, which will bring even more variety of opinion, living on the south side of Chicago is an entirely different experience from living on the north side, lakeshore (east) side or west side. I think, by the way you identify yourself as "southsider", that you already recognize this fact in Chicago. The same is true of Indy. Both cities are diverse in income, race and cultures. They are both cities and they offer the advantages of such, but they are also very different and as a consequence both are very valuable for opportunities and for growing experiences.

Why should there be a comparison between Indianapolis and Chicago? I was not trying to compare them. They are incomparable as they are different and that is the good thing. MC has the advantage of being able to experience the differences and gaining from them. My original point (many posts back) was not that MC should not relate to Chicago........ it should relate to Chicago.....however MC residents should also open their eyes to the benefits of their own capital city occasionally and not shun it or hate it.

I am an Indiana native and proud to be one. If I have one "influence", it is as a Hoosier. I was born in southern Indiana, lived the majority of my life in central Indiana and now am a northern Indiana resident. I have found by living in many Indiana towns, cities and areas and amongst many different original and transplanted residents, that the major Hoosier influence is one of friendliness and openness. The friendliness has been evident everywhere I have been in Indiana. I have also found openness everywhere....it may be expressed slightly differently but it is still overwhelmingly an open and honest attitude statewide. But then again all I can relate is my own experience.

[IndyTransplant]

IThis region of the country is way more honest and open. Some people take it for rudeness, but I wouldn't have it any other way. You almost always know where you stand with people from this part of the country.

I did forget one more thing I wanted to say also. Your opinion above about the honesty and openness in the NW Indiana/Chicago area has appeared in different wording in many posts by many different people in this forum. Your thoughts above are one example. kapkomet in an earlier post mentioned being " brutally honest" and there are many others, in many areas of the forum, relating the same idea. Since the idea appears so many times, it appears to me to go back to what Johnny Rush was talking about also. He mentioned how proud we seem to be, "bragging" he said, about our poor health habits. Many people also seem to be bragging about an honesty and openness "that some people could take it for rudeness" or "brutal honesty".

I applaud openness and honesty. I appreciate openness and honesty. I consider myself to be an open, honest person, but I hope I am also a friendly, and even sometimes a tactful person. As a good example, this post is not the most tactful I have ever posted, but may well border on the brutal honesty that seems to be most appreciated here. However I do not think brutal honesty is the only way to truly be open and honest. And although I do not myself practice it enough, I do also appreciate a little humility now & then.
Different strokes for different folks.

In response to Ang's "Amen" and lament that she can not tell for sure where she stands with people in her new area. ....to be totally honest and so you all know where you stand with me....I like all of you (from what I know of you through this forum) and I love the debates and honest airing of thoughts, ideas and feelings that is apparent in this forum. Sometimes, possibly, a little more tact could be employed at times, but overall "it is what it is" here and I appreciate it. I hope to meet you all in person some day soon.

Please do not feel you have to respond with how I stand with each of you, my feelings are a little tender today and I am not sure I can take that much brutal honesty.

[Ang]

So far we have managed to have a get together near the board's anniversary (12-11-06) for a "Meet & Greet". There are posts and pics in City Living ( http://www.citybythelake.org/forums/index....c=1847&st=0 ).

I think this year we might try something in warmer weather.